How I Built My Small Business

Will Stults - The honest truth about starting an e-commerce business! A growing trend from smartphones to DUMB WIRELESS?

• Will Stults • Season 1 • Episode 33

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Will Stultz chats with us about the ups and downs of starting an e-commerce business. Will is the co-founder of Dumb Wireless, an e-commerce site that consolidates all of the world's best non-smartphones and accessories and sells about $100,000 worth of dumb phones and accessories per month. They also offer their own SIM cards, their own MVNO network and have collaborated with the Unplugged tag to offer solutions that can help people break free from their technology dependency.

Dumb Wireless has been featured in the New Yorker, the Wall Street Journal, BBC and on CBS National.

This episode is sponsored by Pareto Labs, an online business education platform.

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Will Stults:

Focus on one thing. Oh my gosh, I've seen so many people put so much time in other people's money his own money into this business, but drifting left and right and saying, no, we're not only gonna do this, we're also gonna do this, this, this and this. And then it turns out you're good at none of those things because you're doing so many of them. But I would say, focus on one thing thing.

Anne McGinty:

Welcome to the 32nd episode of how I Built my Small Business, the show that is dedicated to sharing the insight that entrepreneurs have about how to start and grow small businesses. Join us as we unravel the stories behind their entrepreneurial journeys. I'm Anne McGinty, your host, and today we have Will Stultz chatting with us about the ups and downs of starting an e-commerce business. Will is the co-founder of Dumb Wireless, an e-commerce site that consolidates all of the world's best non-smartphones and accessories. They also offer their own SIM cards, their own MVNO network and have collaborated with the Unplugged tag to offer solutions that can help people break free from their technology dependency. Dumb Wireless has been featured in the New Yorker, the Wall Street Journal and on CBS National. You can find a link through to his business in the episode's description. Thank you to our listeners for being with us today. Will, thanks for coming on the show.

Will Stults:

Thank you so much for having me, Anne.

Anne McGinty:

What inspired you to start Dumb Wireless? What?

Will Stults:

inspired you to start Dumb Wireless. So the start of Dumb Wireless came from myself hitting six hours a day of screen time and needing to make a lifestyle change. So I got really interested in these minimal phones and found it to be really confusing. Actually, the process of getting off a smartphone was so hard All these questions of carrier compatibility and so on did end up finding a really good phone that worked for me and also my partner, daisy, and we had the idea why don't we create kind of a one-stop shop to make it an easier process for people to look at getting off a smartphone?

Will Stults:

And since then we've kind of branched out to other low-tech accessories as well and the whole goal of our business is just to help people have a better relationship with technology. Now I'm definitely a millennial, so I'm looking at 30 in the next few months, so I grew up with flip phones, so I remember what it was like and I held out for a very long time on the smartphone because I was nervous about what I would do with it. And then it came to be true. There's a growing community out there that is interested, and especially parents as well are starting to take it very seriously.

Anne McGinty:

I think you just nailed it with the parents. I don't know if you have read Jonathan Haidt's the Ancient Generation. It's right here. As a parent you know he mentions attention, fragmentation and behavioral addiction and the opportunity costs and the sleep deprivation.

Will Stults:

So you know, that book is making the whole space have a bit of a moment right now. I didn't realize how massive of a book this was going to be, but apparently it's speaking to a lot of people now and I guess parents all around the country are devouring it right now.

Anne McGinty:

So what has it been like starting a business in this space?

Will Stults:

It takes work, just like a full-time job really and I think a lot of times entrepreneurship and especially e-commerce, is pitched as this like just start your own business and you'll be making that passive income. That's not at all how it works. I think Shopify, and especially dropshipping and stuff like that, it's like a field of broken dreams and it really does take a ton of work to have a successful online store and I keep my personal phone number as the customer support. It's been annoying at times but I don't want to stop doing it because I love it. Every time someone tells me I didn't think anyone was going to answer, they don't even know where to start A lot of people with getting a non-smartphone and we can just lay it all out with them on the phone in 10 minutes.

Anne McGinty:

What was some of your experience before starting Dumb Wireless?

Will Stults:

So the first thing was apparel. Like a million other people, I had to start my own apparel brand when I was young and I was a salesman at the time. So I did have money. I was making very good income for early 20s six figures and all I did was work. I never went to college, I was just obsessed with this sales job.

Will Stults:

But I put all that money into the apparel and I was so dead set on this has to be USA made. I felt like I couldn't be stopped. I felt like so egotistical looking back but in my mind I was like I'm literally the next Ralph Lauren. I think I'm going to build the best brand of all time. And it did not happen at all. But I was dead set on USA manufacturing. So we actually cut and sewed all the garments, start to finish in Colorado and it was insanely expensive. I mean, h&m can make a peacoat for five bucks. I made a peacoat for 170 cost. So overall it wasn't going to work. Unless I found a way to be in this ultra luxury brand of fashion with 100,000 other brands competing, it wasn't going to work and eventually it just fizzled out. I think if I knew what I knew now, I could have made it work, but I don't get to go back and do it again, and nor do I want to.

Anne McGinty:

Well, I think we learn as much from our failures as we do from our successes, so thank you for sharing that. What has the journey been like? Starting Dumb Wireless?

Will Stults:

Well, this was the first time I wasn't the manufacturer, I'm just kind of creating. The marketplace is the goal now. I think being a manufacturer gives you a much larger advantage because anybody can be a reseller. There's nothing proprietary there, you're just a reseller. So I've had to build a brand on dumb wireless and compete with advertising just to make it the spot that people go to learn about non-smartphones, and it's proven to be a very resourceful tool for people. I'd say the amount of risk you take is a little bit less because you're really just buying inventory and that becomes your risk rather than the whole manufacturing.

Anne McGinty:

How are you competing with big online retailers like Amazon?

Will Stults:

Amazon has created an unbelievable experience for the consumer. It's just so easy Anything you want online, you know you can buy it faster on Amazon, and they have everything. And then the return policy is no haggle and sometimes they don't even ask for the item back. So it's like ridiculous and we wonder how we can compete with that, and I think that's going to be the battle for every small business online, and I think people are kind of sold this lie.

Will Stults:

I've seen ads with, like you know, mr Beast the YouTuber, and it's like I started a Shopify store and I sold out my entire collection and then it goes ka-ching, ka-ching, ka-ching dollar signs on the camera. The amount of young people that are going to see this ad and fall on their faces, it has to be well over 90% of people that try. It's going to be really hard to get people to check out on your site that isn't Amazon or a major company. Now They've almost made it, I think, to where you need to pay to play and you need to get on the platform now if you want to compete, and then you're just going to be competing amongst other Amazon sellers, nickel and diming each other for the lowest price.

Anne McGinty:

And competing with some of the retailers on there who are shipping from overseas, correct?

Will Stults:

Oh the Teemu, oh Teemu. Don't even get me started on Teemu, I think Teemu. Oh, it's the worst, you know, the TikTok ban going on right now.

Anne McGinty:

Yeah.

Will Stults:

I would like to see Teemu also thrown in the mix there, because they don't even pay taxes, which is just amazing.

Will Stults:

I know, that they found that loophole, but it's like they've turned shopping into a game where you don't shop because you need something, you shop because you're bored. If anyone has time, 10 minutes of your day. Cnbc did a phenomenal video on Teemu it's called the $10 smartwatch and video on Timu it's called the $10 smartwatch and it was so well done and it just lays it all out like how Timu has created this marketplace where their slogan is shop like a billionaire and they can sell you a $10 smartwatch and somehow they're making money. I know it's not ethical. Is the long story short?

Anne McGinty:

Timu found the loophole. You know if you're not, you don't even have to pay the taxes. Like, how unfair is that?

Will Stults:

I don't know why we can't regulate that Like today. I don't know who would support not regulating that these small American companies got to pay taxes and then this overseas conglomerate is just tax free all day.

Anne McGinty:

Yeah, Getting back to dumb wireless. How much money did it actually require for you to get that business started?

Will Stults:

Luckily I was able to work in small MOQs or minimum order quantities, with companies like the Lifone, getting started and then was able to grow that number over time. We had to reach out first 50 times to some of these manufacturers just to email us back. So that was quite challenging for us because we're not just buying refurbished devices and reselling them and we're definitely not drop shipping you anything from China. We're actually stocking all this stuff. So that was the tough part of getting started. But luckily I was able to do small order quantities with a few companies to create a presence and build the brand, and now we're just starting to be able to do larger purchase orders. Finally, if somebody wants to compete in this space, they're in for a rude awakening, but I know they're coming. You know it's a buzzy subject right now. Do you think it's a little bit prime for bad actors and I think we might have some come into the space.

Anne McGinty:

Just remember that competition is actually good for business, so don't necessarily think of it as a bad thing. It could just mean growth in the dumb phone industry, which could be good for everybody in your space.

Will Stults:

I think it is. We certainly want the competition amongst manufacturers too. That's been the biggest hiccup. Honestly, I think we have wonderful options right now. I will tell you, they could 100% be better and we need them to be better. And I'm really glad to say, and this time next year, the options will look a lot different and we will have some really compelling options to get people off smartphones, Whereas now there are some really good ones. But there needs to be some tweaks and improvement and luckily these companies have worked really hard, these niche companies, and I think next year this time, there'll be some really amazing products out there for non-smartphones.

Anne McGinty:

So tell us how have your sales been.

Will Stults:

I think we're up at least five times from last year. Just to give you context, we're doing over $70,000 a month in phone sales probably over six figures a month in total revenue soon. But there's a lot of cost with that. But we decided to do this, not because of money. I really do mean that we wanted to do this because we want to help people get off smartphones and we really believe in what we have. So we're keeping this around as long as we can.

Anne McGinty:

So what are you and Daisy currently using?

Will Stults:

as we can. So what are you and Daisy currently using? Daisy's been on the light phone solid for over two years now, without going back, truly committed to the dumb phone. I use a tool called unplug that we sell, which has been very effective for me so I don't just drift off on my smartphone again. So unplug it's with a cue, it's just like a little tag. We found it to be a really good tool for parents, but also adults, because you have this little tag. It's an nfc tile, so it's tap to pay. Is nfc, so like if you have a newer smartphone, you can use your phone to tap to pay. This has that little sensor in it and when you tap your phone to it it locks and unlocks your device. So they have a really well designed app and you configure. You know. You just put in what are your distracting apps? What do you need to block out? You select all those and then when you tap your phone on the tag, it's going to lock it and you are hard locked out of there until you tap it again to unlock it. So if your problem is, when you leave the house, you can't stop looking at your phone. You leave this at home and you're hard locked out, and it's found to be very effective.

Will Stults:

But also for parents, because a parent can give their kid whatever smartphone they can go through. They can block the browser as well. Like, if you block the Instagram app, Instagram will also be blocked on the browser. It won't be accessible period. So the parent can set up the phone and then the parent can hold the tag and maybe on Saturday they're on a road trip or whatever and the kid will say OK, mom, let me, let me get on the web for a little while. We're in the car I beg fine, it's Saturday, I'll unlock your phone. The car I beg fine, it's Saturday, I'll unlock your phone. But the parent can have the key so they can have a phone with Uber, Google Maps, their camera, talk and text. Obviously you know all the useful tools, but they can completely put the brick wall on distractions.

Anne McGinty:

And I noticed on your site that it says that you can sign up for a dumb wireless service plan. So how did you go about creating your own service plan on the T-Mobile network?

Will Stults:

That's a very complicated thing. It's called an MVNO network. It's like Mint Mobile. You've seen probably 100 ads with Ryan Reynolds.

Anne McGinty:

Yeah.

Will Stults:

So we essentially have our own Mint Mobile without him to market for us. We offer plans on T-Mobile essentially as an MVNO network. It was something we were interested in but never really had the capacity to do it. It's a ton of paperwork and a ton of money. To start one, you have to file in all 50 states, and there was a startup in Europe that's actually backed by Google and we were able to work with them because they set up the MVNO themselves and then they have partners on that and we were able to be one of their partners, kind of around the time when they were still new, and so we've been able to launch our own service plans on T-Mobile through them without having to go through all the logistics of being our own MVNO. Wow.

Anne McGinty:

That's a great workaround, yeah. So where do you see the dumb phone trend going Like? Do you think this has sustained growth?

Will Stults:

competition coming. I think there should be options that bring a lot of that utility from the smartphone so they can be a part of society in every way, but have a non-smartphone. Everybody seems to be in agreement here that we have a bit of a problem on our hands with smartphones. My dad didn't get one until like six years ago and he told me he's like I can't stop. He's a hockey fanatic and he's like I can't stop looking up hockey things every time I get the chance. This is really a problem for like almost all generations right now, and we need to look at better solutions, which is what we hope to be a part of. Even the people that are the biggest benefactors of it now are talking out against it, so I think it's a conversation almost everybody's ready to have.

Anne McGinty:

Yeah, I have groups of friends that would agree, but since you're resistant to social media, how else do you plan on getting in front of your customers?

Will Stults:

We've worked with this wonderful group of parents in Manhattan Beach. We also do pop-up shows, hoping to do some in San Francisco. I think it's fun if we could go to Silicon Valley and market non-smartphones. We do the Venice shows every year. But also we've just been lucky with press. We had the New Yorker reach out, we had Wall Street Journal and we have some more coming up too. A lot of people want to run this story right now, which is really cool for us.

Anne McGinty:

And what do you say to people who aren't ready yet to shift away from a smartphone, but who do want to reduce the length of time that they're on one?

Will Stults:

Don't give yourself an unlimited data plan. This is an amazing way to help with your screen time habits. If you get that cheaper plan, you get to save money, but also it's going to force you to be more mindful of how you spend your time on your phone, because you're not going to want to run out when you really need the data. For an adult, this is a major lifestyle change to go from a smartphone to a non-smartphone, unfathomable for most Americans, and that's where we think unplug kind of comes in. It's like that's going to have nearly the friction.

Anne McGinty:

And speaking of friction, how do you advise parents who are planning to get their kids a phone for the first time?

Will Stults:

Around 13, I think is the age when you can start losing the bond if they get the phone. When we think about the future we want to live in as we age like, I, would prefer our kids grow up to be very smart people that work on the biggest challenges the world faces, and I am very troubled as to how that's possible when all they're going to be doing is being entertained by something in their pocket, whether it's they're being creative and making music or becoming excellent in their field. How can they go there if they're constantly needing to be entertained? That's one of my biggest concerns with the phone. I find frustrating because the kid always says mom, you won't give me a phone and I can't talk to my friends. You're being a jerk. And then it's like I've had families call in or they're all on the phone and they're like I need to be able to talk to my friends and I'm like awesome, let's get you a life phone, you'll have talk text. And they're like no, not that, because the reality is they want the iPhone 15. They want the full experience they want to get on social media. So I think it's really unfortunate and I think there's actively very talented people working on this right now. That's. The silver lining here is that there is going to be much more investment into things like that. A phone we are excited about is Wisephone. The WisePhone 2 comes out the next generation phone probably in about a month, and I think that's something that's been worked on very, very hard by a well-financed team that has allocated the right developers and resources to make a really good product. And that phone is really built with parents in mind. It has a whole parent portal backend.

Will Stults:

I'm not trying to come down on other parents because I don't even know what it's like yet, but I think parents can be complicit in it too, because they're so stressed out with their job and everything.

Will Stults:

And let's be real, the phone is an escape. I get it in an airport situation where it's very stressful and it's like, yes, for the love of God, please watch the iPad for now, but like when it's all the time, then they're developing this horrible habit and like they're so addicted to screens they're so drawn in by them. Again, not to come down on the parents because life is so stressful. The parent is super stressed out with work, trying to provide in this day and age and be a parent that the parent also wants to drift off on the phone, and so it's like why don't we all just have our phones and then we all go drift off, and I think that's what's happening. I think it's not just the kids I've. I'm not judging other people because, like I said, I hit six hours a day screen time on my phone. I was a Twitter addict, I was no better and I still struggle.

Anne McGinty:

So getting back to a little bit more on just your journey as a business owner, what advice would you give to someone else who is aspiring to be an entrepreneur?

Will Stults:

If you want to be an entrepreneur, go for it. Be open to learning, be open to failing and growing from that. Always Focus on one thing. Oh my gosh. I've seen so many people put so much time and other people's money his own money into this business, but drifting left and right and saying, no, we're not only going to do this, we're also going to do this, this, this and this. And then it turns out you're good at none of those things because you're doing so many of them. But I would say, focus on one thing.

Anne McGinty:

So okay, for a last question here, and I know you're still young, but looking back, what advice would you give to your younger self?

Will Stults:

I would say to young people if you feel absolutely heartbroken, maybe it's over a person or a friend not wanting to be your friend, or your idea failing, or you're not going to school where you want, or you feel like you're not going to be a big shining star you always thought you were. That does not matter, it's all in your head. You're not going to care about these things. In six years I know mental health struggle is real and depression is real and there really is nothing you can do about it sometimes. But definitely don't romanticize the sadness and being apathetic about the world. When you're young, you should be carefree and you should be getting out there, obviously, have regard for other people and so on with the carefree statement, but you should just be focusing on living your life, meeting other people. If you get in a relationship with someone and it doesn't work out but you swore they were the one, so what? They weren't. That's why it didn't work out. You just got to keep moving forward and be kind to people. Once you get to the mid-20s, you're creeping up on the biggest thing.

Will Stults:

I could say that I didn't do, that I would have liked to learn from, but can't. So it's the advice I would give would be to put down roots, whether it's a city or job or the thing you're creating, you're working on. Put down roots and try not to jump ship and go all over the place. That's a big mistake I made. Now I look back and it's like you know, I really don't have long-term friendships because of that or roots anywhere, and I still don't know where I'm going to go. So if I could go back, that's definitely something I would do differently. There's just something so special about having community. We have more first world comforts than we've ever had right now, but also more isolated than ever before. So I think community is really one of the biggest aspects of wealth that's overlooked. So when you're young, I think you should focus on building that somehow.

Anne McGinty:

I think that is fantastic advice. It's very insightful. Thank you so much for coming on the show and sharing your whole experience with all of us.

Will Stults:

Absolutely. Thank you for having me.

Anne McGinty:

As always, thank you for being here. Today's key takeaways Starting a business takes a lot of work and is just like a full-time job and can require more time than a full-time job. E-commerce takes a ton of work to have a successful online store, especially considering that you will be up against giants like Amazon. If you want to understand more about how giants like Timu are operating in an unfair landscape, check out CNBC's the $10 Smartwatch. Overall our phone use has gotten out of hand, but that also means that new industries and opportunities are opening up to help address the problem.

Anne McGinty:

If you can think of a solution to this problem, you may just stumble upon a new business idea. If you want to be an entrepreneur, be open to learning and failing and growing. Focus on one thing at a time so you don't dilute your efforts. When you're young, you should be carefree and living your life and meeting other people and consider putting down roots and building community. Community is an aspect of wealth that is often overlooked. That's it for today. I release episodes once a week, sometimes more, so come back and check it out. Have a great day.

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